02-11-2017 07:48 AM
Can I propose that new questions being considered for addition to the Google Maps Contribute feature are first vetted by locals (say, needing approval by 50 level 4 or 5 guides), before being approved and they get added for every single establishment in a country.
Case in point: anywhere in Ireland selling food or drink for consumption on the premises must, by law, have a restroom. But Google now wants me to answer "Does this place have a restroom?" for every single bar, café and restaurant I've reviewed in Ireland. The answer in every single case is "Yes, they do, or they'd be closed down by environmental health inspectors."
Similarly, 99% of establishments in Ireland take cards, and 100% of places that do take cards take both credit and debit cards. But we get two questions for every place about cards, and then we also get asked 'Does this place take checks?' Maybe personal cheques are still a thing in the USA, but not here. It's annoying and frustrating, and being honest, the vast majority of guides aren't going to know the answer, because we're not in that 1% minority still using them.
Having these sort of "Not applicable in my country" questions being checked for suitability for inclusion in a country in advance would seem to make more sense than removing the question after enough people fill in the "Not appropriate for my country" feedback question.
02-11-2017 08:36 AM
If every single bar, cafe and restaurant in Ireland had a restroom there wouldn't be a need for environmental health inspectors.
Overseas tourists unfamiliar with local laws will be looking for an answer to the question, not an absence of information. If Google assumed all bars etc had a restroom the result could be false positives.
02-11-2017 01:03 PM
02-11-2017 06:35 PM
@AntonS wrote:Well... yes, every single bar, café and restauraunt in Ireland does have a toilet! By law: http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1988/si/147/made/en/print
That Statutory Instrument Regulates restaurants. Bars and cafes fall outside of the definition of restaurants contained within the instrument.
The question could provide an algorithm to help decide if an establishment that serves food should be categorised as a cafe, not a restaurant.
But my original point remains - just because a law exists it does not mean there is a 100% compliance. To give a nearby example - the Irish government has been fined by the European Court of Justice for a failure to comply with a directive relating to septic tanks.
In a perfect world perhaps the question should include a scale to show how clean the toilet was, with an option for no toilet. That could provide useful data for places tourists not to visit and for places Environmental Health Officers to carry out inspections. I wish I had thought of that one when we were asked to suggest questions.
02-11-2017 07:21 PM
Seriously, Peter? A pub without toilets? How would that work? It'd last a day in business before a twitterstorm erupted! 🙂
I'm not going to go trawling through legislation to find you the correct statutory instruments for pubs, cafés, restaurants, etc., but trust me, they're there.
Actually useful questions to ask would be - as you say - are the toilets clean? Are there disabled toilets? Are there baby-changing facilities?
02-13-2017 08:25 AM
@AntonS wrote:<snip>So for Ireland and the UK, at the very least, Google could indeed set the value to the answer to that question to '1' and be 100% correct with no risk of false positives.<snip>
100% and "no risk" are very specific assertions.
The assertions are not correct, even for Ireland's capital city, even for a Michelin-starred restaurant (according to a review from 4 months ago on the website of the Irish Independent, Ireland's largest selling daily newspaper).
Ireland's latest Michelin-starred restaurant doesn't even have a loo but it's all about taste
(loo is a regional word for toilet)
02-13-2017 12:26 PM
I second that. Obviously, the questions are country specific so they would not need to write new code to remove questions just for one country. Your issue is almost the same for Germany:
- checks are not used in Germany. I doubt I can even get checks if I wanted to nor would a business accept them. Please remove them for Germany (no idea about all of EU but I think it will be the same)
- bathrooms, as stated before, it is the law in Germany. I have never in my life heard of a business serving drinks or food in Germany not have a bathroom. I have seen places with broken toilets that had a porta potty outside while it is being fixed. And someone was worried that foreigners google to see if the restaurant has one. Just mark every bar/restaurant as having one. They would not be allowed to open without. Not sure if this an EU law or country specific though...
- fireplaces... I am pretty sure I have never seen a fireplace in a German restaurant or bar (fire code maybe?). Maybe in a hotel lobby in the mountains. Let's say 0.01% of places have one, who would think it makes sense to now ask this for every place? Please remove that...
- great beer selection... there are very, very few places that have a beer selection. In the states you have 3-10 beers on tap. This is not how it works here. You have one brewery as the supplier and have 1-2 choices of that brewery. Sometimes it is because a brewery owns the bar or it is because they provide free chairs, ashtrays and whatnot and offer discounts. But it will be one brewery and as such, not really a selection. And I have been to a zillions bars in Germany. It is always like that, please remove that question...
- add some code so the questions don't contradict each other. Accept cc? Accept debit card? Is it cash only? Huh?
And I mark those questions every **####** time as not appropriate for my country... does anyone even look at that?
02-13-2017 03:56 PM
Dude, enough pedantry already - it's in Blackrock Market! As in, an indoor shopping mall. And the market has toilets, shared between all of the other businesses in the market, in exactly the same way as not every outlet in a food court will have their own individual toilets.
02-13-2017 04:06 PM
Exactly, @ChristopherCFFM! Local knowledge should determine suitability (or not) of questions, not one-size-fits-all.
Case in point, the beer question - ten years ago, there were a handful of breweries in Ireland, and just a couple of distributors. Every single bar sold Guinness, a couple of eurolagers and one American lager, and one type of red ale. That was it. Nowadays, there are over 40 craft breweries (and the number is growing) and dozens of bars selling a huge variety of Irish and international craft beer - some not even selling Guinness. So the beer question would have been pointless, but now is very much relevant.
On the topic of bars, there's one that's popping up now "Does this place have an 'all you can drink' deal?" Seriously? Any place trying that in Ireland would quickly go out of business, either going bankrupt (!) or being closed down for breach of licensing laws. I really don't think that question is appropriate for anything except cruise ships (which don't appear on maps!) and possibly some resort hotels.
Very good point on the contradictory questions, too! They are very annoying. Especially "Does this place sell alcohol?" "Does this place sell hard liquor?" for places classified as bars! 😉
02-13-2017 04:24 PM - edited 02-13-2017 04:25 PM
Yes @AntonS, the 'beer in bars' scene is very different in different countries. Keep it for Ireland but not Germany.And it would be so simple. Ask once a week/month on the local guide forums (only accept answers from locals) OR start listening to flagging a question as inappropriate (I still doubt anyone reads them...).
And yes to the all you can drink question!! I know some cheap restaurants offer all you can eat. I remember bars in Israel offering that and I think I had it in Spain. But never ever in Germany. Flagged it a zillion times but... you know... nobody reads those. But I was surprised about that question because that would not be legal in Google's homeland. Is that maybe wishful thinking for a Google intern that hopes to find out for his upcoming Euro travels? I am 100% convinced interns write those questions...
Yes, the sell liquor question for bars is also a good one. I believe in the states you need a special liquor license. No need for any kind of license for alcohol here. I only saw this a few times here in Germany with Arabian restaurants. Would be a good question though for Dubai. Finding booze was a royal pain there 😉