Shapes and Places - Guidance on where to add edits and photos including both flat and photo sphere

Maps look complex but really they’re not. The subject that seems to vex many people Maps is that there are two basic concepts known as Shapes/Polygons and Places.

The terms shape and polygon tend to be used interchangeably and at a high level that’s right, but there are some complexities. Lets start by thinking about the concept of a polygon and that will lead us into what these shapes are used for. A polygon is basically a shape made up of lines that do not intersect and form an enclosed area. They’re widely used in the cartographic side of mapping to represent the world including

  • natural features such as continents, islands, mountains, oceans, rivers and lakes;
  • geo-political features such as countries, cities, towns, villages;
  • administrative features such as postal codes, hospital zones; property boundaries;
  • man made features such as railways, roads, paths, and buildings;
  • assets such as power lines, underground pipes; and
  • many many more.

Everything in the world is represented by polygons when placed onto a map. Not all possible mapping features appear on Google Maps. To the casual eye Maps looks like its just shapes but there is more behind the scenes. Every shape has metadata that is used to describe the shape, how it connects or relates to other shapes and how it represents its part of the real world.

Places represent somewhere a human can visit and may have things they can do when they get there. Places are often referred to as Locations. The two terms ore more or less interchangeable.

Shapes can fall within other shapes, states fall within countries, cities and towns and villages fall within states although these can be at country level where there are no states. Places fall within shapes and can also fall within other places.

Isn’t mapping fun? The real world is complex, maps try to represent that multi dimensional complexity in a pictorial view that helps us poor humans understand the world around us and get around in it.

I’ve got a background that includes knowledge of Mapping and Geospatial Information Systems so I’m familiar with these concepts but I note that many Local Guides are not. It is very important to understand the concepts to know where you can place your content such as photos and photospheres otherwise you will likely fall foul of the Maps User Contributed Content Policy which I highly recommend all Local Guides read and are familiar with.

You will see photos listed along with shapes such as cities, these photos are not added to these places directly, they are gleaned from places that fall within the boundary of the shape by a Google algorithm. The algorithm surfaces the images it thinks will match your needs at the time you searched. Here are some example shapes that are not locations. Shapes are usually but not always outlined in red when you search for them to show you the extent of the shape.

This first example is the country where I live, Australia. You can see the red outline that shows the extent of the country shape. All the places within Australia fall within this shape. Note that country shapes are complex and often not contiguous to cover islands and offshore territories. The photos you see at the country level come from the places within the shape boundary and are not added directly by Local Guides or Street View photographers.

The second example is a state shape in this case Tasmania, the southernmost state of Australia (not including the Antarctic Australian Territory). All the places that belong to Tasmania fall within this shape. The photos you see at the state level come from the places within the shape boundary and are not added directly by Local Guides or Street View photographers.

The third example is a city shape where my friend @PennyChristie calls home called Sydney. All the places that belong to Sydney fall within this shape. The photos you see at the city level come from the places within the shape boundary and are not added directly by Local Guides or Street View photographers.

Similarly this fourth example is a town or village shape called Kerang which is a small rural country town in the state in which I live. The photos you see at the town level come from places that fall within the town shape and are not added directly by Local Guides or Street View photographers.

Now locations (or more correctly places of interestPOI”) are the things that show up as pins on the Map. They are places you can edit, review and add photos to. In this example Third Wave Cafe is a place you can visit with things you can do when you get there - eat! The café place falls within the shape of its address and also the shape of its building. Confusing? A little. Think of it this way, you use the address to find the building that the place you want to visit is within.

Now this example is a little more interesting because it looks like the place is both a shape and a place at the same time, in reality its not, its just like the café. The place is the pin that has the data you can edit, review and add photos to. The place falls within the shape that is the lake itself and that falls within a wider shape of the park that surrounds the lake. When you dissect it this way even this confusing example is really a very simple set of layers that come together to make a map and help you find the lake so you can visit and do things there. Incidentally this is an awesome calm water spot for canoeing or kayaking or rafting with kids.

This next example is a whole lot of places showing as pins that fall within the shape of the city of Melbourne that falls within the shape of the state of Victoria, that falls within the shape of the country of Australia. It is simply more layered shapes that take you on a journey to a final place. Local Guides can edit, review and add photos to these places but not the shapes that they fall within. Street View photographers can add their photospheres to these places.

There is another kind of shape that we cannot edit and these have either been brought in from official sources or come from the old Map Maker days which are simply a named polygon or shape that have no associated place. Here is one called Fingal Drive Reserve but also includes things such as rivers, mountains and lakes. This is a small park that needs to have a place associated with it. Its easy to tell the difference, you search for what seems to be a place or find one on the Map and click on it but there are no features to add reviews, photos or suggest an edit. These can be reported within the Maps App although I’ve had better success getting them fixed via the Maps help community. https://support.google.com/maps/community. The Local Guides interface does not allow additions of photos or edits to this sort of shapes, however adding 360 panospheres through the Street View App is allowed.

Now while the base concepts are a little complex when first seen, it always comes down to just places within shapes within shapes within shapes. If you always make sure your Local Guides or Street View activities are on Places (Locations) not Shapes then you’ll be ok and you’ll be doing a great service to your community. It is ok to add photospheres to the Map without tagging them to a Place. Photospheres are positioned spatially and are visible as blue dots you can drop Peg Man onto to view the sphere.

Sometimes unintentional opportunities open up to add photos (particularly photo spheres) directly to shapes other than those that are allowed and those that do it quickly learn that they should not do it because they quickly get rejected and are no longer visible to anyone other than the person who added them. In my opinion these contributions are spam and they’re rejected for several reasons, the first one is that they are in violation of the policy, secondly they’re not fair because they get many more views than photos at places and thirdly because they make it more difficult for Google to surface the content you need when you need it when there is artificially arbitrary content placed by people.

Now because the world is complex, there is one and only one exception to the rule that photos can only be added to places. If you are making the blue lines of Street View, this is done by submitting a video stream using the Street View App and supported camera hardware. These images can get placed along roads, tracks and paths that are shapes. These images are not placed directly by the Local Guide or Street View person they are placed algorithmically by Google. These are ok.

Note that occasionally places will be locked for some or all types of contribution by Local Guides and Street View people for various reasons that are outlined in the User Contributed Content Policy linked above.

As a Local Guide if you find images and photospheres at places where they don’t belong, report them help keep the Map clean of trash and spam.

I hope this has been helpful and I look forward to answering your questions in the comments below.

Paul

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Thanks, @PaulPavlinovich for this much needed explanation.

I will be happy to link to it next time someone needs help understanding where we can / can not add photos.

Since you explanation is rather long a quick tip might be relevant to share also: Areas/shapes have no link or button named Add photo. This might be the quickest and easiest way to know if you are dealing with an area/shape or a pin.

If there is no Add photo link or button this is Google’s way of telling us that photos and reviews are not welcome here.

Cheers

Morten

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@PaulPavlinovich

One challenge:

Let’s say there is a lake which is an area. Adding photos and reviews is not possible.

Someone decided to create a pin with the same name as the lake mainly to make it possible to add photos and reviews.

Should these co-exist or be merged?

How do we best decide when to create a pin within an area when it is closely the same?

Cheers

Morten

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I’ve just added an example of that @MortenCopenhagen these are named polygons. I’ve had good success getting them addressed via the Maps Help Community but yes, there are often examples where people have added a place as well (I’ve been known to do that) then get them merged via the Maps Help Community. Note that when you front up to the help community be prepared with evidence from a reliable source such as a government website or document.

Edit: I totally forgot to say thanks for the feedback so thanks @MortenCopenhagen :slightly_smiling_face:

Paul

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Great post @PaulPavlinovich , very detailed and indeed very helpful to shade some lights on those concepts :wink: .

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Thanks @LuigiZ I hope its helpful - I tried to make a complex topic simple, I know it will still put some people into head spins :slightly_smiling_face:

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Great post @PaulPavlinovich - I immediately bookmarked it for future use, and I’m pretty sure I will be able to use it !

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Wow @PaulPavlinovich ,

these are many insides. It should be highlighted!!!

Thank you very much.

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Thanks @TorM and @JanVanHaver hopefully you and others will find it useful :).

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Very interesting. Thank you for sharing this, @PaulPavlinovich . I bookmarked this :slightly_smiling_face:

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Thanks for adding the Named Polygon Shape example, @PaulPavlinovich .

I still think we need a tiny bit more guidance from you. Please.

  1. If we are faced with a lake having an area and a POI created to allow reviews and photos. Then what documents could be needed to get them merged? Maybe you could share an example of how you successfully got such two entities merged.

  2. If faced with a shape/area Lake that will not take pics and reviews. And creating a normal pin is not the way forward, then what should we do? I have appealed via feedback to have the staff change the pin so it will accept pics and reviews. But I was never successful. What would you suggest we do? Again sample arguments would be highly appreciated.

Sorry to keep nagging on you :wink:

Cheers

Morten

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@PaulPavlinovich Thanks for sharing this. It’s very useful. For polygons without a specific location POI, usually Maps would suggest to add a location. For the few times I faced, this, that was what I did. Is that the recommended thing to do? Or when you say report via Maps app, what specific type of report should be done?

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Thanks @HiroyukiTakisawa glad you found it useful.

@MortenCopenhagen I would take that query up with the Maps Support Community. My state government has a public website which gives information about land parcels https://mapshare.vic.gov.au/vicplan/ and I’ve used this to back my requests.

I don’t think there is a right or wrong answer there @StephenAbraham I too have added places like this.

Paul

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Muy interesante, lo estudiaré con calma, muchas gracias @PaulPavlinovich

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Salut ! @MortenCopenhagen ; @PaulPavlinovich

Va rog sa dezvoltati putin subiectul : Exista zone / puncte de interes la care/unde, dv. sustineti , ca google “stie” si nu permite adaugarea de poze/imagini ( identificabile prin faptul ca lipseste butonul “Adaugare imagini/poze” ) .

Daca acestea sunt locuri publice … care sa fie motivul interdictiei ? de fapt … ?? :disappointed:

Dar , sa presupunem si alta situatie : identificam o locatie , facem cateva poze de aproape … cand sa le postam constatam ca pentru pozitia respectiva nu se pot adauga poze . Nimic mai simplu … ! ne departam ,… schimbam obiectivul si facem o / cateva poze vizand aceeasi locatie , ba chiar si zona inconjuratoare !!

Daca stiti , … cine il alimenteaza pe google cu informatii … inainte !! ?? , si de ce o poza sau imagine a unui contributor are mai putina valoare decat acelea ?

Multumesc pentru intelegere,

2be4all

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@2be4all

Please check if your concern is not addressed in the replies below.

Cheers

Morten

Salut @MortenCopenhagen ! @PaulPavlinovich

Apreciez pozitia dv.

Nu va puneti nicicum problema ca si altul ar putea fi la randul lui expert in acesta chestiune.

Pe urma …, afirmatia : " Guvernul meu de stat" poate nu corespunde peste tot… Si atunci ce te faci ?

Senzatia pe care o lasati este ca tratati cam tot pe “persoana fizica”…, ca sa zic asa… , privat.

Am citit cu atentie mesajele si nu am identificat raspunsuri la aspectele punctate.

Cu bine,

2be4all

@2be4all

I’m not sure the translation is perfect or maybe I just don’t get what you are implying.

You asked for Google’s reasoning. You know pretty well that Google is not going to answer such questions. It might be lost in successions of changing goals and staf. Maybe no one remembers today. Or maybe other issues are more important for Google to give priority to.

Your guess is as good as mine.

If you waste some of your time on take photos that are not welcome on Google Maps, the just let it go. In stead of getting worked up and frustrated just let it go. If you can’t, then make lists to ducument such issues.

In my opinion there are millions of other and better photos to be added and ditto edits to be made.

Sorry for not addressing your issue more precisely. But I can’t. In this case letting go is my best advise. Alternatively document, share and suggest usable and pragmatic solutions in the Idea Exchange.

Maybe @PaulPavlinovich can give a better answer.

Cheers

Morten

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Salut @2be4all
Nu există interdicție. Unele locuri sunt dezvoltate pentru a fi utilizate de Local Guides, iar altele nu. Uneori, aceasta este o acțiune deliberată a Google (cum ar fi drumuri, poduri, căi ferate) și, uneori, sunt date incomplete pe hartă. Când nu puteți adăuga imagini sau examinați un loc și credeți că acest lucru este greșit, trimiteți feedback prin intermediul aplicației Maps și, dacă este cazul, Google îl va corecta.

@MortenCopenhagen este corect prin faptul că, dacă Google are un motiv pentru a face ceva, așa cum este dreptul lor, vor păstra acest motiv confidențial.

Paul

3 Likes

Salut ! @PaulPavlinovich ; @MortenCopenhagen

Va multumesc pentru raspuns,

O intrebare as mai avea , daca admiteti : Includerea unei imagini / poze facute de altcineva ( posibil cu mult timp in urma ) intr-o poza facuta de mine ( atentie ! … nu copie 1 la 1, … ci, includerea artistica a imaginii intr-o noua imagine ) este sau nu apreciata /binevenita sau incalca vre-o regula.

Cu bine !

2be4all