I found post regarding business list on basis of skin colours in Local Guides Connect. Is this fair and not promoting Racism?
@TraciC @DeniG @StephenAbraham
Editing to update below screenshots and link
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I hope that you don’t mind if I chime in on this post, as I found the question to be very timely and also valid as a concern. I praise you for inquiring about what may be a potentially negative, unintended consequence of having such a list.
I know that I might be opening myself up to criticism with the current social climate regarding fairness and equity among minorities, but I don’t think that having such a list would be beneficial in the long run. I believe that if such a list does come to fruition, then in the spirit of fairness and equity, a number of lists would need to be created for every minority (Asian owned businesses, Women owned businesses, LGBTQ+ owned businesses, Mormon owned businesses, and so on).
I am not against the idea of supporting minority owned businesses, but I also believe that if someone chooses to do so that it is that individuals responsibility to find out that information on their own. I don’t think that Local Guides should be supplying such information, as it could be used for reasons that are not for supporting any particular minority. I believe creating a list such as what was described could potentially open the door to less positive outcomes in the long run. However, I also am of the opinion that as long as we continue to point out the differences than equality is difficult to achieve. But I am interested in how others feel about this idea. 
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@NeerajKumarIndia I can only tell you what my opinion is, and my opinion is only what I feel as myself (as specific to replying to this specific post). My opinion does not represent anyone else, and does not represent me helping out as a Connect Moderator.
Let’s also of course wait for official response from Google on this.
I want to point out from
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/racism?s=t
“racism - noun”
"> a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human racial groups determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one’s own race is superior and has the right to dominate others or that a particular racial group is inferior to the others.
> a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.
> hatred or intolerance of another race or other races."
Supporting a cause for a community doesn’t necessarily represent racism, and we have got to ask whether these causes are championing equal rights for all, or championing higher rights for a particular group of people.
So, we have got to think around contributors who support BLM or BOB, are they championing equal rights for all? So if the answer is equal rights for all, then, it would not be a cause for racism. (Which I believe is the case)
And as I said, let’s also of course wait for official response from Google on this.
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@NeerajKumarIndia Thank you for starting the conversation. I appreciate your point. I did create the list and the post.
Let me give you a little background:
-While creating this list, I learned about a lot of businesses that I would have never seen or heard of otherwise. Sometimes we get caught up in our own world and our digital channels only feed us information that fits into our current environment. It was a great exercise in learning about another culture. Especially since I consider myself anti-racist, but still have so much to learn.
-Can everyone do this research on their own? Yes! Will they? Probably not. It is great to have a list readily accessible. I would consider this list similar to if I wanted Chinese, pizza, Italian, or Greek. Sometimes I want to support a business owned by a POC, not exclusively support these businesses, but to add it to my mix of businesses I support.
-Most businesses owned by POC are small businesses. So this could also be considered a small business list.
-I wouldn’t usually visit a lot of businesses on this list. This list is going to help me get out of my comfort zone and support businesses and learn from different cultures. I should have been doing this all along, but systematic racism has educated me and put invisible barriers on me that I am just starting to recognize.
-Easy access for others to step outside of their comfort zone.
-Also when POC from all over the world visit Chicago, this list will provide them easy access to explore what their culture looks like while in Chicago. I always find it interesting to see what US born food or experiences look like when I travel to other countries.
One thing that is amazing about the Local Guides Connect Forum is that people come from all over the world. Currently, in the United States, we are uncovering some ugly truths about racism. It may not be the same case for where you are located. Businesses owned by Non-POC will not suffer as much through these difficult times due to the way our system is set up. However, those businesses owned by POC have are less likely to survive during these difficult times. Hopefully, this list will lend some support.
I appreciate your feedback and hope that we can both learn from each other.
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@StephenAbraham So glad I had the pleasure to meet you. Your posts are always so throughout and helpful.
Thank you for volunteering your time to build and maintain such a valuable community that reaches the entire world.
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My respect to all community 
Thank you so much for your post. Above You are mixing food with something else. I am not from there but when I saw this I was sad, You totally trying to change my thoughts about a nation.
Wish other will agree.
You are requested tell me, What you are able to find in this post. Is this not Ra_ism otherwise, No argument. Please.
- I am unable to reply frequently as LGC not works properly on my Android handset. Sometimes with spelling errors.
Thank you !!
Hi, I’m my opinion this is probably how we perceive this message. It’s not racism but this movement is against racism to promote businesses of those who have been victim of it.
See the background of BlackLivesMatter movement and you’ll see its not actually only for the people with black skin but it meant every life matter without any discrimination or privilege.
You should remove this post because it’s not what you benefit from freedom of speech but it’s hate crime.
You may disagree and that’s your right.
Thank you!
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Many minority businesses were targeted as a result of this movement. You could make a list of businesses that were damaged by the rioters and the looters, and SUPPORT those businesses. Many BOB were also destroyed as a result of this movement. Protect small businesses and stop pandering to a RACE issues. This is a Local Guide platform that supports all communities in an effort to make the world a smaller and more accessible place. For that we need to keep our focus on businesses and how to access them and making them more accessible.
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This is a very well worded response and I believe sets the scene for addressing an imbalance @RJ1
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@user_not_found and @Sarbland
This nothing more than ra_ism on the name of supporting one community (Or include all minority, May be for name only). What is going on here is just a promotion in shadow of education or help. Are you not hurting people with different colours. I felt bad and reason behind this post.
Do you want to define ra_ism according to yours ease. Here post by @RJ1 is just a reaction against action. In my opinion, LGC Should not allow such post.
*Will LGC allow me to promote any business here on religion or caste basis? There is no end of Ra_ism, Do remember.
@PaulPavlinovich Thanks. I’m finally learning how this forum is such a great connector of experiences, ideas, and people. Thanks you all of the time you volunteer to keep this space warm, open, informative, and safe for sharing.
Finally, thanks for the education on trains. 
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Dear bro as I said earlier, that’s my opinion and you may disagree. And so I’ve right to disagree with you.
Again, I would stand with minorities who are suffering and if this help them to stand up being the mist affected community in the World then the purpose is served.
Again, this movement isn’t to promote but to discourage the racism.
What I think, your post need to be removed by the LG community, 
#peace #blacklivesmatter #everylifematter
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Bro,
Original post is a clear Ra_ism.
Your opinion on what basis?
Biased opinion are harmful to everyone.
Reaction against action?
Rac_ism against Ra_ism?
And start promotion where easily you can.
Second thing why are you saying to remove it? Is it you or your fl_g saying it? Do you know status of minority under the f_ag which you holds. Request to post for them also. I am not against anyone’s f_ag but when my post will targeted then will definitely ask the reason behind.
If you have to say something about rac_sm, Then welcome otherwise let others nation representative to comment here.
Why to remove post?
You already know status between two nation and commenting here in this way shows something else. Please also check who kudos(Single) here your comment as of till now. What this all reflects?
*Please don’t relate this comment to hurt/rac_ism.
With all due respect, racism is not an “American issue,” in fact most minorities enjoy freedom and equality there, so it is not an issue to post on Connect. The issue I have is how businesses are being targeted by rioters and looters. We have to protect local businesses by keeping the world informed of their locations so that we may continue to financially support them. The Mac Market and Deli in Washington is a perfect example of a business that’s been a part of the community for 35 years by Korean migrants. They were targeted for what?
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@user_not_found
Very true, Such post should not be allowed on LGC, That’s why my post is here. It is just reflecting bad impression about a great nation. Even who is responsible to moderate here are supporting with theirs list in that Post’s comment section.
Problem is everywhere, But Discrediting nation is not a good sign.
#MyRespectToAllCommunityAndNations
Very sad, we are living in 21st century we should respect all caste, creed & culture. Colour should not matter & connecting it with business I totally disagree if fact we should support & buy from them whom people give tag as black skin . Such people are good by heart.
We should give respect to everyone the colour is God gifted we can not change it…
Lastly it should be removed it’s my opinion.
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@NeerajKumarIndia woooho come on man see your words and attitude… This is racism and now I got why you are supporting racism because you even not aware of what Racism is.
You are disrespecting my nationality, my flag and my pride. I wasn’t expecting such immature response from a person at this level of LG. This community has no borders and no room for haters, I wonder how come you survived here till now.
I’ve no issue with any country or nationality and if you are from India, I have friends from your country not just in this community but in person.
Go man get a life and learn to hate racism.
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Considering my role in this forum as a Connect Moderator, I wanted to be clear that the opinions in this post are mine alone and does not reflect Google’s or the Local Guides program/team. Sorry… just have to be super clear about that as I’m not representing anybody here but my own.
I think there are multiple things to reflect on here so I do apologise if I’m long winded. Also, this is what I understand of the situation and I may possibly be wrong. So please be gentle with me! @NeerajKumarIndia @RJ1 for your attention primarily but also to the rest of the folks reading this thread/post, feel free to comment.
Racism and Discrimination
Discrimination can come in all sorts of flavours such as religion, race/ethnicity, gender, sexuality, age, social standing etc. Racism is one form of discrimination. Also, you can have either negative or positive discrimination. My understanding is that the term “racism” comes with a negative connotation i.e. it is an act of trying to negatively discriminate against another group of people based on their race that in some way hinders, suppress or discredit that same group of persons. Whether that group is a majority or minority, it doesn’t matter. It is still a negative discrimination.
In some countries, there are rules that favour a specific group of people (usually ethnic minorities) and they are classed as positive discrimination. The idea behind this is that those groups require extra support and assistance to give them a leg up and help them gain a standing in the wider community. This is like a socio-economic balancing.
Of course, what’s considered positive discrimination by some can also be viewed as a negative discrimination by others. I can cite personal examples but I don’t want to open another can of worms!
A List of Black Owned Businesses vs A List of Manchester’s Top Coffee Shops
This is more of a technical point i.e. I’m stripping away the argument of race. If I create a list of top coffee shops in Manchester, does it mean that I’m against other shops that sell other non-coffee products such as tea? If Manchester has 15 coffee shops, but I only include 10 coffee shops in my list, won’t that mean that I’m telling the world to not go to the other 5 coffee shops?
A ranked list (e.g. Manchester’s Top Coffee Shops) is, in some way, discriminating by nature because I’m telling folks which is better than the rest. If you’re the owner of a coffee shop that is not in my list, you may feel that I’ve affected your business by not recommending your shop to the world.
A general list (e.g. Black Owned Businesses) is not discriminating because it’s not saying which is better or not. It is also not trying to compare itself with other businesses. It is just a list (or if you want to think of it differently, a database) of businesses owned by a black person(s). Kinda like a list of museums, a list of banks, a list of LGBTQIA+ friendly places etc.
What’s the intent?
Personally, I feel that this is the more important point to focus on. What is the intent of having a Black Owned Business list? Is it to discriminate against other races? Not probable because anybody can create a list of, say, White Owned Businesses, or Asian Owned Businesses or whatever. There’s nothing stopping folks from doing this.
This is happening because we have reached a point in our civilisation where racial discontent have risen to the top! Folks are tired of feeling excluded, of feeling like second class citizens, of feeling negatively stereotyped, of feeling biased against whether by the system or by the rest of the population. It is a moment in time where the world is trying to address this imbalance. When this challenging situation is overcome, that focus will shift to another imbalance in society (take your pick, there are many!).
My view
This not an act of racism because the intent is never there to suppress any other groups of people. It is not causing any direct harm to any other businesses. Ultimately, it comes down to the consumers to decide where they want to shop and do their businesses. It is just a general list, that’s all.
Moreover, it is a reaction to what’s happening in America (although it’s not a problem exclusive to America, hence we are seeing protests in other countries as well) and is an act of solidarity to highlight and celebrate businesses by black owners. It is acknowledging that the black community is going through a hard time and we, whatever our race may be, are there to help them gain their equality, to help them and many others who are discriminated against, to have equal and common rights.
Just as we organise events for say, Earth Day, and write posts about it and how we can help the environment and what we can do to address the problem, the same can be said about the Black Lives Matter movement.
But you may ask why just the black community: X, Y and Z races are also having problems? Well, my answer to you is that history and circumstances have brought this issue that the black community are facing to the forefront at the moment but that doesn’t diminish all the other problems we have in other areas of our lives! The work that we do here will actually help inform us on all future problems of similar nature. It may be a small step (in a bigger picture) but it’s still a step in the right direction.
Let’s not stop at helping just the black community! Let’s work hard to give everyone, and I do mean everyone, an equal chance at living!
Of course, it’s easier said than done. Having this discussion is a good start in understanding the situation. And however big or small our actions may be, we all have a part to play.
Thanks for your attention!
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Mr @NeerajKumarIndia , I never saw such a worst and political comment on Connect Forum as you write above. I strongly condemned it and request to respect everyone here. If you don’t know how to respect others, and anyone’s country or flag, then you don’t have right to be here. Just see again, what you wrote " Second thing why are you saying to remove it? Is it you or your fl_g saying it? Do you know status of minority under the f_ag which you holds. Request to post for them also."
is this the way to write about any person, flag, country or community?
Because this a community of positive people, but we can feel negative vibes by your every comment and your post as well. I m agree with Mr @AdrianLunsong
, “positive Racism” is the right word for this initiative. But maybe you cannot understand.
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Thank you @RosyKohli
That is what the matter. Why to tag any colour here with anything.
I respect everyone.
Thank you for kind comment.
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