Adding Fight4Aylesbury Exhibition in London, UK

[PaulAtherton]

Hi @DeniGu wonder if you can assist? The Fight4Aylesbury exhibition is an important exhibition here in London and not particulalry easy to find. I visited 2 days ago and have just uploaded 21 photos to add the place on Google Maps. The Photos clearly show the building from the outside and track my route to the flat door and inside. They show the number of the flat door, the arrows that are described on the posters on how to get there, the name of the building and the exhibition poster, as well as images from the exhibition.

I provided the exhibition’s Address, Twitter Account as the WebLink (they don’t have a Website but do have an Instagram Account which I realise has more information in, so will try again with that now) and the organisors Mobile Phone number as the contact number in addition to the 21 photogrpahs and the address.

You can find news coverage of the exhibition on the BBC News webiste here.
Aylesbury Estate: “We’re Fighting For Our Homes”

The edit was rejected as Not Applied, which I rarely get these days, so I was wondering what more information I can add to get this exhibition added to Google Maps?

Many Thanks.

Paul Atherton (FRSA) - Google Maps Local Guide (10).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Atherton

[PaulAtherton]

Hi @DeniGu ,

The instagram weblink didn’t work either (see message above).

I listed it as an exhibit in my entry both times.

Many thanks for the assistance.

Best

Paul Atherton (FRSA) - Google Local Guide - Level 10
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Atherton

[gmapas]

Oi, @PaulAtherton

Essa “exposição” é temporário ou fixo igual a um museu?

Se for algo temporário não se qualifica para o Google Mapas.

Veja abaixo a “Política de conteúdo de Contribuições gerado pelo Usuário para o Google Mapas”

Na seção que trata da qualificação de um lugar e/ou empresa consta:

INELIGIBLE BUSINESS & PLACES

Fake or made-up businesses

- Temporary, one-time events

Private property (e.g. celebrity’s home, your home)

Seasonal/recurring businesses without a permanent location

Businesses with no physical presence or local service area (e.g. call centers, online-only businesses)"

Há também outros problemas. O Google não aceita links de redes sociais como indicativo de wepage de um local. As vezes isso passa pelos filtros, mas o Mapa não quer esse tipo de link na sua plataforma.

"Do not provide phone numbers or URLs that redirect or “refer” users to landing pages or phone numbers other than those of the actual business, including pages created on social media sites."

Acredito que por isso sua edição foi negada.

Sucesso

Gil

[PaulAtherton]

Hi @gmapas ,

Thanks for that.

All exhibitions are by their very nature temporary - so that would seem like an oxymoronic position from Google if they have an Exhibit option for the location?

Many of our museums & exhibitions here in London are in Private Resdiences, like Buckingham Palace and The Wallace Collection but clearly they’ve been approved by Google Maps. So that policy seems eratic to me too.

As you say, Social Media links often get accepted (I’d say a third of my edits), in the 21st Century organisations are way more likely to have an instagram account than a website. But at the end of the day the geolocator on the Photos should be sufficient as evidence of the location. The website/social media is merely there for up to date information for users.

Ultimately, the whole point of Google Maps is to assist people to find locations they wish to get to and this is obvioulsy one such place.

Appreciate your assistance.

Best

Paul Atherton (FRSA) - Local Guide - Level 10
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Atherton

[MortenCopenhagen]

Hi @PaulAtherton

Is the exhibition location permanent or temporary, as explained by @gmapas ? Buckingham Palace would certainly be considered permanent in my opinion.

What category did you suggest? Maybe you can add the exhibit location/venue and not the exhibition itself.

@gmapas I have never had any issues with adding an Instagram profile as the website of a Business on Google Maps. But there can be regional differences in this.

Cheers

Morten

[PaulAtherton]

Hi @MortenCopenhagen ,

Thanks for getting back to me. Like with Buckinham Palace the location is a Landmark so a building ergo permanent, but the exhibition, like with Buckingham Palace is temporary (the palace is only open to the public for three months in the summer each year and the exhibition there changes every time).

As mentioned above I listed it as an Exhibit. So I’ll try listing the building as a Landmark and not use any of the social media links to the exhibition.

There is a Wikipedia page about the building, do you think that would assist the automated software?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aylesbury_Estate

Thanks.

Paul Atherton (FRSA) - Local Guide - :Level 10

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Atherton

[MortenCopenhagen]

Hi @PaulAtherton

I remember our earlier interactions about some art pieces in the public domain.

From the Twitter account I learned that the exhibition is open only 14-23 of April this year. That is clearly outside what can be added to Google Maps.

The wiki page you shared made it clear that it is a huge estate covering several addresses and the purpose is housing (private homes). This clearly goes against the purpose and guidelines of Google Maps: to lead people to (permanent) places of interest.

If this exhibition is housed in some space that is normally used for other purposes you are out of luck.

If one of the categories Art gallery or Event venue or Art center precisely describes the place (not the exhibition) then this can be added. When claimed the owners will then be able to share an update on Google Maps about the specific exhibition. They can add graphics and mention the dates it is open.

That will be the correct way to use Google Maps. Trying to bend the rules and categories will sooner or later get the place removed.

All the best

Morten

[PaulAtherton]

It’s a map. People meed to find things. We as local guides facilitate that.

There’s no rule bending here - just assistance.

I have a sense that as you’re not a Londoner you don’t understand how our city works and that’s fine. But it changes at a rapid rate, it’s buildings can be listed and knocked down and then rebuilt like The Carlton Tavern. They go from Private to public ownership in a blink of an eye like the BBC or the Bank Of England. But the key thing is getting people to the places they want to see using Google Maps. And once this exhibition had received Nationiwde News coverage on the BBC people were wanting to find it and struggling to do so.

If we as Local Guides don’t step into recitfy that, then this is all a bit pointless isn’t it?

The exhibition is about what the building should and shouldn’t be for. It’s its very raison d’etre but as the building is significant in its own right, it should be registered as a Landmark on Google Maps regardles (it has both historic and archetural significiance) before/if it is destroyed entirely regardless.

Just for the record Buckingham Palace wouldn’t come under any of those headings you listed either, it is a Priavte Domestic Residence, but like I said, you need to be a Londoner to understand the nuance of the place.

[MortenCopenhagen]

Calm down, @PaulAtherton

I was just trying to help you understand the limitation of Google Maps and why you can not add a temporary exhibition. I don’t make the rules.

Best of luck

Morten

[PaulAtherton]

Are you suggesting as Google Local Guides who want to support our communities that we should just be acquiescing to a system that doesn’t benefit the very people we’ve come here to support?

And if the rules don’t work for your community then surely we must either change them or find a way to achieve our goals within them?

Best

Paul Atherton (FRSA)

[gmapas]

Olá, @PaulAtherton

Obrigado por me mencionar.

All exhibitions are by their very nature temporary…

Em tese, sim. Por isso perguntei se era algo fixo ou temporário. Pois sendo algo temporário as atuais políticas do Google não permitem. Acredito que por isso sua edição foi negada.

“Many of our museums & exhibitions here in London are in Private Resdiences, like Buckingham Palace and The Wallace Collection but clearly they’ve been approved by Google Maps. So that policy seems eratic to me too.”

Eu entendi assim. Mesmo que um museu esteja em uma residência - tem exemplos assim no Rio de Janeiro, Brasil e em Toronto, Canadá - ainda assim, esses locais tem endereço e um local fixo.

As you say, Social Media links often get accepted (I’d say a third of my edits),

A questão de links de redes sociais ao que parece é atualmente tolerado pelo Google, mas isso nunca é muito claro. Por não ter informações claras e concisas nas Centrais de Ajuda do Google é uma área “nebulosa”.

“But at the end of the day the geolocator on the Photos should be sufficient as evidence of the location”

O texto mencionado por mim sobre redes sociais é a única política, ainda que de forma não muito clara, que menciona “link” de rede social. Então muito dessas revisões podem ser subjetivas.

Concordo com você que muitos lugares tem uma rede social ao invés de um site, mas a questão aqui, acredito, opinião pessoal, não é essa. Acho que não interessa para o Google gerar tráfego através do Google Mapas para redes sociais. Acho, opinião pessoal.

Ultimately, the whole point of Google Maps is to assist people to find locations they wish to get to and this is obvioulsy one such place.

Acredito que sim. Mas com relação específico a uma exposição temporária em um local que não é fixo fiquei com as seguintes dúvidas:

• Em Toronto há por ano há mais de 300 exposições temporárias. Se todas fossem colocadas no mapa. Como seria a remoção? Quem seria responsável por fazer essa limpeza no mapa?

Sempre é possível criar mapas personalizados através do My Maps.

Para auxiliar as pessoas você pode criar um mapa pessoal marcando todas estas exposições com informações complementares, inclusive detalhando como encontrar. Permitir que seu mapa seja mostrado na pesquisa Google para auxiliar quem estiver na busca específico por esse tema, exemplo abaixo:

Captura de tela de uma pesquisa sobre exposições em Toronto no Google. Como um dos resultados é mostrado um mapa pessoal criado através do My Mãos com várias atrações marcadas no mapa, imagem abaixo.

Sucesso

Gil

[gmapas]

Oi, @MortenCopenhagen

Obrigado por me mencionar

@gmapas I have never had any issues with adding an Instagram profile as the website of a Business on Google Maps. But there can be regional differences in this.

Morten, sobre links de rede social no Google Mapas é um assunto nebuloso, veja:

• Nenhum artigo da Central de Ajuda do Google Mapas diz qual tipo de link é permitido numa empresa ou local. Sequer isso é mencionado;

• Não há na Central de Ajuda de Local Guides nenhuma mençao a qual tipo de link os Local Guides devem inserir numa empresa ou local no Google Mapas;

• Nas políticas do Google Mapas não há nenhuma mençao a qual tipo de link é permitido nas fichas do Google Mapas;

• Aqui no fórum não encontrei nenhuma informação consistente a qual tipo de link os Local Guides devem colocar numa empresa; (assunto que merece um dos seus belos artigos).

• O único local onde há menção a qual tipo de link uma empresa deve utilizar é na Central de Ajuda de Perfil de Empresas do Google, aqui, onde diz:

“Do not provide phone numbers or URLs that redirect or “refer” users to landing pages or phone numbers other than those of the actual business, including pages created on social media sites.”

Por não haver clareza neste tema, eu uso para mim a política acima. No entanto o que o Google acha disso ao longo do tempo eu disse aqui, é difícil de saber.

Já houve um tempo que o Google Mapas mostrava avaliações do Facebook nas fichas de empresas; Já houve um tempo, o Google Mapas indexava links de rede social no Google Maps, mas silenciosamente removeu. É uma relação comercial complicada, eu acho.

Então de fato não dá para saber o que o Google acha de links de redes sociais.

Por exemplo, algumas empresas no Google Mapas são suspensas por colocarem links de rede social no campo site. Outras não. Edições com links de rede social são geralmente aprovadas, mas eu não uso e nem faço edições indicando isso. Mas tenho notícias de edições negadas por colocar link de rede social.

No Brasil há um ditado, "o que não me é proibido é permitido"

Sucesso

Gil

[MortenCopenhagen]

For others reading this thread it might be interesting to also read this thread where the My Maps solution was also suggested to @PaulAtherton

I even created a sample My Maps based on his data, to no avail.

It is not uncommon for local guides to get frustrated when realizing that Google Maps was not designed to accommodate all imaginable uses. I have been there and done that.

I think boundries actually makes Google Maps more user-friendly to the end users in the big picture.

Imagine if everything individuals wanted to add got added. As a private company Google sets the rules and boundaries. And in both cases lists and Google My Maps are usable alternatives.

Or @PaulAtherton could team up with peers and art exhibition organizers to create a website with MAPS links to all places including those Google decided do not qualify for a pin on Google Maps. Maps directions to all sets of GPS coordinates can be linked to from such a web site.

To suggest Google Maps to include temporary exhibitions in the list of approved categories is also an option, but in my experience it will need considerable efforts beyond posting a proposal here on Connect.

Cheers

Morten

[MortenCopenhagen]

@gmapas

I just wanted to share my practical experience with adding links to Instagram and Facebook on Google Maps.

I know the guidelines are not super clear on this. And that is why I though my observations were interesting for you to know about.

All the best

Morten